Best Diesel: Shell? Caltex? BP? Mobil?

[Hoppo]

BP Diesel problem?????

G'day all

Have a mate in Melbourne with a Citroen Dispatch Diesel van (12 months old) - he had to truck it to the dealer the other week because it had started to blow smoke like mad.

Dealer found problem to be the fuel - completely drained his tank - he only uses BP diesel (as have I in most of my fills). Interestingly I tried to fill up at 5 BP stations a few days later and none of them had diesel - well, the pumps all had the "sorry - not available" skirt on them. Also, observed a tank apparently being emptied at another BP which also had no diesel. So I gave up and filled up with Shell.

Does anyone know anything about this? (I didn't have time to ask at the servo's)

[Spoddy]

I have started using Caltex premium diesel (Vortex). Similarly to BP's premium but not available around these parts. A noticeable drop in the amount of smoke and also a far quieter engine, though still enough to know you drive a tractor .

So my questions are- how many VW TDIs are using this new fuel (new in my location)? And how has it changed the performance/economy and noise?

I also have noticed that after 3 tanks ,and my son is back from Melbourne, that the economy is also lower by about 0.3l/100km.

The thing I am not sure about now is whether I should keep using Morey's diesel smoke killer which I have been using for about 7 tanks. Could the improvement be from an accumulation of Morey's or the new Caltex?

[dazag]

Yeah I'm about to start running the Caltex Vortex diesel and se how my Skoda RS TDI (125kw) runs with it, since we dont have the BP Ultimate diesel in NSW as yet. Will let you know how it goes.............

[6thgear]

i tend to go to caltex for petrol and diesel, partly because they are more abundant in my area and better priced...

have had no issues with them, engine smooth and all. never really sat down and compared with others on efficiency or anything though...

no complaints from anyone else i know, caltex seems to be ok...

[Arctra]

Vortex vs Std Diesel consumption

Hi guys.

Over the Christmas/New Years break I managed to cover some 3700km's in my Tiguan TDI and kept track of some of my consumption stats. When I filled with standard diesel I put a squirt of "Moreys Diesel Engine Smoke Killer".

Standard Diesel:

• BP Std D in Grafton - 380km's @ 7.17l/100km's (Grafton -> Gold Coast)
• Caltex Std D in Armidale - 130km's @ 9.58l/100km (Waterfalls around Armidale)
• Caltex Std D in Dubbo - 683km's @ 8.12l/100km (Dubbo -> Parkes -> Sydney via Richmond and 1 week Sydney driving)

Premium Diesel:

• Caltex Prem D in Five Dock - 728km's @ 7.42l/100km's (Sydney -> Grafton)
• Caltex Prem D in Gold Coast - 255km's @ 9.33l/100km's (Spirited driving around GC & Brisbane mountains)
• Caltex Prem D in Gold Coast- 773km's @ 7.23l/100km (Gold Coast -> Armidale via Casino hills)
• Caltex Prem D in Armidale - 763km's @ 6.73l/100km (Armidale -> Dubbo)

Now obviously some standard got mixed with premium which skews the figures a bit, and the driving conditions weren't the same for all tanks of fuel, but here are the average consumptions:

• Standard Diesel - 1193km's @ 7.97l/100km
• Premium Diesel - 2520km's @ 7.35l/100km

So it seems on the premium diesel you can get about 1.1km extra per litre of fuel (0.63l/100km) than standard diesel with the Cetane booster (Moreys Diesel Engine Smoke Killer) when doing relatively open road driving. I would assume the difference is even bigger when you don't put the Cetane booster in standard diesel, but that's an experiment for another time. Comparing consumptions for city driving is another experiment I would like to do if I have the time and/or inclination.

I hope that helps answer some peoples questions as it sure has for me.

[yowie]

Were told by the dealer to only use BP diesel, so mostly BP Ultimate, tho I've not paid close attention, and to not put additives. That was May 09.
So far so good. Av 5.5 on trips, and 7.1 around town where there is usually some freeway. 17,000ks of that, no complaints except when you cant find a car nozzle and have to spend forever trickling in from the truck pump

[yowie]

Well, we got 778ks from the last tank mostly city this time, and couldnt find anything else at night with the dial reading 60 km to empty, (took 52 litres exact, so probably not quite right), I blinked and put it's first load of Shell in.
Sounds the same. Will see if there's any other difference.

[kahle81]

Petrol/diesel

Forgive me if this sounds rude - I know car enthusiasts will always be car enthusiasts but thinking that one petrol or diesel product is better at one servo than the other is simply crazy. I am a chemical engineer and I have worked in refinery laboratories and trust me, just go to the servo where it happens to be cheap on that day and fill up. You can go home happy that you have some of the best quality normal automotive fuel in the world.

[Jmac]

To add to that you can have a great batch from your " favorite" servo and your pride and joy will be a cut snake and fill up again at the same bowser and be down on power. hit or miss if you ask me but still wouldnt fill up at a dungeon of a servo even though i would rather give the money to the privateer.
Surely we have some of the best sweet crude in the world but we export it, am i right or wrong???? would love to hear more, ive invested lots of my spare time gong to BP seminars held by the IAME but still feel lost with it all. Iwill still attend these seminars to learn more after all the internal combustion engine is like us crap in crap out.
Jmac

[neil]

Forgive me if this sounds rude - I know car enthusiasts will always be car enthusiasts but thinking that one petrol or diesel product is better at one servo than the other is simply crazy. I am a chemical engineer and I have worked in refinery laboratories and trust me, just go to the servo where it happens to be cheap on that day and fill up. You can go home happy that you have some of the best quality normal automotive fuel in the world.

I do recall one of our members near the blue mountains having issues with
black smoke, it even went as far as VWA, adviced the dealer to advice
the owner to use BP and the black smoke issue was resolved.

[yowie]

Forgive me if this sounds rude - I know car enthusiasts will always be car enthusiasts but thinking that one petrol or diesel product is better at one servo than the other is simply crazy. I am a chemical engineer and I have worked in refinery laboratories and trust me, just go to the servo where it happens to be cheap on that day and fill up. You can go home happy that you have some of the best quality normal automotive fuel in the world.

So why would the dealer urge us strongly and directly to use just BP?
And we have, until last week, when a late-night vat of Shell found its way in.
INterested in all this,kahle81, and what you bring, so not rude at all.

[kahle81]

I just think that you have to take into account an unimaginable amount of factors to be able to predict how the complex mixture of compounds in your fuel tank is going to act in your engine.

Firstly there is the crude composition which varies worldwide - the crudes in and around australia/south asia are of very good quality and that's why the oil prices run off the Singapor tapis crude prices and not the american (even though they still report the american in the news). But these crudes vary in their composition so what is being bought by the refineries is always changing.

There are so many factors in a refinery which affect the product. There are obviously standards and targets but most products that come out of the refinery are blends and can vary day to day. So your lubricity, sulphur, driveability, cetane, flashpoint, plugging point, volatility and chemical content are always changing.

I think the most important thing for fuel quality is the tank that it is stored in at the servo. Different servo's have different tank cleaning schedules (to remove moisture, gums and contaminants). I would buy my fuel from the newest servo with the newest tanks if I had access to that information.

That being said, there are always going to be bad batches of fuel, which is not always the refinery/servos fault. We would commonly test samples from tanks in which you could see flakes of rust and bits of rubber from the fuel tank. There are always incidents of water contamination in servo tanks as well.

Quite frankly the dealer would know SFA about fuel but VWA would. Perhaps they have test data or a relationship with BP or perhaps they run it in their company cars but I guess you can't go wrong recommending BP.

[Redman]

I do recall one of our members near the blue mountains having issues with
black smoke, it even went as far as VWA, adviced the dealer to advice
the owner to use BP and the black smoke issue was resolved.

Interesting. BP (as with Mobil) don't have a refinery in NSW and are supplied by either Shell or Caltex.
QLD - Shell & Mobil are supplied by Caltex or BP
VIC - Caltex & BP are supplied by Mobil or Shell
All import their own into Adelaide
WA - Mobil & Caltex supplied by BP or Shell
TAS - Most import their own, or supply by Caltex or Shell

I don't know if they then add additional additives to the product once they pick it up in each state, but I can't see in a state where one is supplied by another how any difference occurs.

[timo72]

Im with gldgti

When you think about the supermarkets have most aussies buying there fuel for the sake of usally no more than $2 a tank, which last most of us 1 or 2 weeks ( a saving of $104 dollars a yr) its ludicrious that we are ruining the compertition for other quality independant resellers of fuel . dont get me wrong I was the same untill I did the sums recently and I am saying quality resellers not two bit guys that put all sorts of **** in there fuel, not all coles and wollies outlets have quality fuel either . It seems funny people out there who have spent reasonably big to get one of the best TDI's out there and then there are worried about $104 extra a yr on diesel when buying from independants.

[silvershadow]

Interesting. BP (as with Mobil) don't have a refinery in NSW and are supplied by either Shell or Caltex.
QLD - Shell & Mobil are supplied by Caltex or BP
VIC - Caltex & BP are supplied by Mobil or Shell
All import their own into Adelaide
WA - Mobil & Caltex supplied by BP or Shell
TAS - Most import their own, or supply by Caltex or Shell

I don't know if they then add additional additives to the product once they pick it up in each state, but I can't see in a state where one is supplied by another how any difference occurs.

It is my understanding the other companies add their proprietary "11 herbs and spices" to the tankers before or after pick-up from the terminal of whatever refiner is supplying the fuel.

Perhaps someone in the industry can confirm if this is just another urban myth or what does occur.